What U All Workin On?

The debate on chops over music or music over chops will go on forever......but what makes the handfull of famous drummers that we all admire is that they do BOTH. and why not.....why does everyone always assume its one or the other.......put some time and effort in and have both then u will get booked because you have great chops or your time and musicality is spot on.......!!!!

people often say....."oh im just a groove drummer".....and often its cause they cant do anything else!

You are right Palmerlouie on both subjects and a big AMEN to the last post.

Digital

Hey Digital,

Virgil's grooves are amazing. I would have to say the only book that can help with these extreme concepts is Marco's book.

I've been working on doing left side stickings, doubles with the left hand and foot in 16ths, then playing grooves with it, and triplets.
I also mess with a inverted paradiddlediddle on my left ande play 6-8 grooves with it.
Also, i like to pick a riff from my band----all our riffs are in compound odd meter. I'll play an 11 footpattern, and groove against it with an over the bar ride pattern, while playing backbeats in the odd phrase, and also playing 4/4 backbeats.

As far as reversing everything--------that takes a lot of time.

I do have a new 4 bar doublebass routine.. Play regular 8th note on hat, and 2 & 4 on the snare. then play a measure with the feet in 16ths, RRLL, next measure, RLLR, then LLRR, and LRRL. Then apply fill ins on the R doubles, then fill ins on the L doubles, then fill in all doubles.
This is helping me execute foot patterns more evenly. And I practice it heel up and heel down.

My 11 Riff is a 16th note phrase in 11, played on the feet as RLL RLL RLL RL. I play a ride pattern of 8th notes, then quarter notes, and 1e&'s with the main snare backbeat on beat 4 of the 11 phrase.
I also created a variation as RLLRRL RLL and rlrl 32nds, then I fill in the RLLRRL like R LrL RlR L play RLL and rlrl on the end. It's a fun intricate pattern, but I can play it better with a Right Foot lead, so go figure.


I'm all about creating beats for my band and soloing, as I'm a more is more type of guy!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=2 face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><table border="0" width="90%" bgcolor="#333333" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="0"><tr><td width="100%"><table border="0" width="100%" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="2" bgcolor="#FF9900"><tr><td width="100%" bgcolor=""><font size=2 face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by FlamTriplet:
Currently working on various odd meter stickings on my feet, while playing backbeats in four or within the odd phrasing. Also playing fill ins for the doubles on my feet.
Working on various clave rhythms on my left foot and practicing three way independance against it, RLfoot etc... And playing triplet rates against them as well.
As far as books go, Marco's book is the best book out there for getting the independance thing.</font></td></tr></table></td></tr></table></BLOCKQUOTE>

Akira's "Interdependence" Video isnt to shabby either [img]wink.gif[/img]

I am with you Flam on the trying to get more comfortable with the interdependence grooves, as in setting up a pattern with the feet, yet being able to vary the pattern but having the dexterity to fill in(with the hands) while keeping the varied groove(very difficult) going. That is where I see the greatness in Virg and Minneman they being able to freely fill in while keeping the groove going. And being able to lead with either hand when filling in which is so darn difficult especially when you are trying to keep those feet right. Man it is frustrating just talking about it "oh well" that is partly what makes it enjoyable, pushing yourself till you start getting the hang of it(mastering it will take alot longer). By the way I know Virg is working on putting out a couple of instructional books in the very near future, should be some challenging material to say the least.

Best regards Digital

Yeah Bozz,

I have to say that video is one of my favorites. every ten seconds is a new idea to schredd on. [img]graemlins/angel.gif[/img]

You guys all sound like you're still young. I'm 49 and have been at this since the age of four. My best advice no matter what kind of practice regimen, routine, whatever...RELAX! Any time you begin to force what you're doing you become counter-productive and it won't matter how much time you practice, it'll suck and you will get into a negative mind-set. Check out all those extremely accomplished players who have gone to study with Freddy Gruber. They were all physical players; Neil Pert, Weckl, Steve Smith, Adam Nussbaum and the list goes on. What they wanted to learn was how to "play" the drums, not work them. Let gravity and physics do the work. Don't "grip" the stcks, guide them. Don't forget, musical expression is the goal no matter what you're playing, Be Bop, Fusion, Country, Hungarian Torture Music, whatever. Whenever you sit down to play at the kit, on a pad, pillow the floor, your thighs; make it a joyful and pleasurable experience. HAVE FUN with it. If you're practicing some dry exercises, mess with it. Play it backwards, upside-down, inside out etc. And RELAX. Reverse the stickings, add accents in unexpected places, play the hand parts in the feet, rest the notes and play the rests. And RELAX some more. The more creative you become in your practice the more creative your musical expression will become.

Here's something; you'll all think I'm a certifiable head case but hear me out. If you ever get a chance to see the Harlem Globetrotters play live in person GO! "But what's this have to do with drums?" you ask. Nothing and everything. Just watching them dribble a basketball one inch off the ground tells a lot about how to play fast finger control singles. It's not the hand, it's in the ball itself with the help of gravity. These guys do a lot of serious 'shedding to do what they do but at the same time it's a labor of love and funny as hell as well.

As to what I work on. Recently, I've been playing all the old hand-foot exercises on a practice pad kit to various sequences. I use a Yamaha DTX and play random songs with and without the rhythm parts, with and without a click. I'll play grooves and solos. Triplets against eighth note time. Duples over 6/8 time. Displaced accents over long musical passages. all sorts of unusual things. Whatever I can come up with. Yes, I do indulge mself with an occasional forray into chopsville, working out things I can't do, slowly and relaxed building speed to where I can play them fast and relaxed.

Happy Drumming.

Hey G I am not 49 but I am 35 not quite a kid and have been playing for about 22 years. I do not think what we were talking about had anything to do with whether we play relaxed or tight or a specific playing style, honestly do not understand where you were deriving your point from. But your points were good and I believe most would agree with you and yes our purpose in practicing is to create music with or without others and even if our tastes differ. I think I am creating music when I play on my own, do not know what you would call it but it sounds fairly good to me.

Beyond HOW we play some of us are inspired by those who are expanding the ability of how we can play and use the drums to make music. I use to find a few ways to play REALLY relaxed years ago but I do not go that route anymore, you know what I mean.

Best regards Digital [img]wink.gif[/img]

That's great G. Don,

But when I play a hip hop beat, i like to phrase in 32nd notes, as well as Nine-tuplets, doing all those fun hand foot patterns that you mention.

I also like to play in 7/8, doing fills playing 5 notes per bar, and subdividing those into triplets(15) or 16ths(20) etc... and playing those fun old hand foot patterns.

This is stuff that i play without forcing myself.

You would think that kids would mention playing fast, but none of here have done that. Although you mentioned it.

I am, however the official fastest all around drummer from the last Warped Tour WFD competition---add the hands and feet and I beat everyone----and I'm the second all around(hands+feet) fastest drummer in the world--recognized by the WFD----of course there are probably many faster than me, but I did go under the clock at official WFD contests.

Anyway, when you practice an exercise, there are SO many ways to enhance it, or permutate it, etc...You know this. But I practice my own things that I (create) or change other's ideas. And things I hear and think of that would enhance my band or my soloing. That's about it, I do what I do, because that's what I want to do. And if what I do sounds like crap, I move on.
To bad Neal Peart studied with Gruber, because I think he fucked up his whole style. And that's what I thought after seeing his DVD. [img]rolleyes.gif[/img]